Vector 2022 on Japanese Wikipedia

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こんにちは @SGrabarczuk_WMF さん
お知らせを読みましたが、回答がない理由は、どのような返事をしたらいいのか分からないからかもしれません。

  1. コミュニティで議論して導入に賛成・反対を決定して回答してほしいのか?
  2. それとも、「私は賛成」「私は反対」と個別の返信をしてほしいのか?

メッセージは翻訳されていますが、表現が日本語的な文章でないので、返信がしづらいのだと思います。

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Thank you, these are very good questions. Now I realize I could have used different words. “Do you agree” suggests a choice between two options: either yes or no. Months ago, we were asking this question, but now, I would prefer to avoid a yes/no voting. Comments and questions would be the best. Examples:

  • “Look, this doesn’t work on Vector 2022. What should we do to make it work?” (This may be about templates, gadgets, buggy look of a given page, etc.)
  • “Works for me” / “I like that…” / “I don’t like that…” / “Why did you decide to…” / “Is it possible to…” / “Could you improve…”

Thank you @SGrabarczuk_WMF , I posted it on at a Village pump, with the reply by Afaz.

1 Like

SGrabarczuk_WMF

I have feedback for you, and it’s much easier to explain it here than at the jawiki Village Pump as I can upload images effortlessly.

FYI: My preferred appearance is normally set to Vector (Legacy).

On the top right corner, there are a lot of frequently used links, and I see an explanation and its short-cut in a small pop up when I move the cursor over on one of those links.

For existing users, we probably don’t read the pop up to locate which link we want. For instance, I look for the word "ウォッチリスト” for the watchlist when I need to visit my watchlist and just click it before the small explanation pop-up would show up. (Sorry, but the cursor itself is not showing up on the image.)

When I see the new version, now the word "ウォッチリスト” (Watchlist) is replaced by an icon. When I move my cursor over it, I see the explanation “変更をウオッチしているページの一覧 [Alt+Shift+I]” (The list of pages you are monitoring for changes [Alt+Shift+I]) in a pop-up as well. However, It does not register into my brain immediately that the icon is for the Watchlist because my brain is looking for the familiar word "ウォッチリスト” (Watchlist) .

Once again, this is a relevant comment only for existing Vector users (or could be just me), and it might be different for new users.

@SGrabarczuk_WMF さん
Vector 2022の印象はとてもいいです。ただ、Wikidata のインターフェースでは UTC Live Clock ガジェットがメニューの中に表示されているので困っています。Wikipediaでは常時インターフェースに表示されているのですが。

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Another feedback for Vector 2022.

When I scroll down a page, the sticky header would show up on the top.

I would like to see a link (can be an icon or text) for the Watchlist somewhere on the sticky header.

SGrabarczuk_WMF

Jawiki has NOT reached consensus on implementing Vector 2022. :rage:

私は “デスクトップ版の改善” を読んで Vector 2022 についてのデザイン意図を理解しました。その上で、 Vector 2022 についての意見を私は持っています。

コンテンツ幅の制限” についてですが、可読性の向上のためにコンテンツ幅を制限するという意図を私は理解します。しかし、私は時と場合に合わせてコンテンツ幅をズームインとズームアウトで変更しています。たとえば、私は熟読をしたい時にズームインをしますし、私はスキャン読みをしたい場合にズームアウトをします。それが Vector 2022 ではズームアウトした際に幅が制限されることにより出来なくなります。それが残念です。

I have posted my comment under the thread talking about Vector 2022 and Double byte Characters: screen shots supplied as well, comparing that on jawap with enwp.

To sum up my post as above. Talking about the layout/blank between the left menu and the page body, I see Vetor 2022 applies a wider blank, and the width looks as if you can fill two double-byte characters. That’s too much, or out of proportion IMHO.

I don’t want to use the button to change back to Legacy Vector whenever I feel uncomfortable with the wider blank/margin. As you say on the description page on Meta, skins are to coordinate Look and Feel. With 2022, those two elements are not bound with a and, feels like I am torn between Look or Feel. Cheers,

I read “Limiting Content Width” - is this the Wikimedia Foundation’s request that authors write articles assuming optimal readability content width?

I understand this intent, although it seems somewhat intrusive to change the default for this purpose.

However, I am unhappy that it is no longer possible to use zoom in and zoom out to narrow or widen the content width.

So I propose to provide a toggle button to maximize the content width. This feature is implemented in Fandom.

Thanks @Hexirp for reading the page!

The main intent is the one related to who we, the team building Vector 2022 and responsible for skins, are. We care for the reading experience. As for the limited width, we want people to quickly scan pages comfortably, read comfortably, and memorize information easily.

Authors may write articles assuming optimal readability content width. This is our suggestion. But it’s also a side effect of a lower importance, and not the main reason for introducing the limited width.

I think it is possible to zoom in and out using your browser. What is missing now that you’re unhappy about?

こんにちは、 SGrabarczuk さん。(「初めまして」の方がいいかもしれません?)

jawp井戸端での「デスクトップ版外装(スキン)改善バージョンの実装について」は読んでくれていると、私は思っています。質問なのですが、読むときに使用している翻訳は「DeepL」なのだろうか?と、疑問に思いました。差し支えがなければ、普段は翻訳にどういう方法を使っているのか、を知りたいです。

@温厚知新 さん 、初めましてさん。

Usually, I use Google Translate. In the case of Japanese → English, I have an impulse to use it, too. But last week, I was informed that DeepL translates better for these two languages. So now, I try to use DeepL to understand what Japanese Wikipedians write.

お応えを頂き、ありがとうございます。
翻訳に「より適切」なのはどのツールなのか、日本語以外は読むことが出来ない私には、知見がありません。一番良いのは、ツールを使わなくても、読み書きできる能力を身に着けることだと、私は思っています。 :slightly_smiling_face:

A list of interlanguage links is on the bottom of the jawiki Main Page. People are having a hard time finding it.


You are right. Very inconvenient for a translator like me. Any adjustment on timeline pls? [quote=“AppleRingo777, post:16, topic:1043, full:true”]
A list of interlanguage links is on the bottom of the jawiki Main Page. People are having a hard time finding it.


[/quote]

[quote=“AppleRingo777, post:16, topic:1043, full:true”]
A list of interlanguage links is on the bottom of the jawiki Main Page. People are having a hard time finding it.

Sorry :neutral_face: I’m just now reading this. How did this come to be for your efforts in June? I am interested in how this evolves. The hirigana skins were always more popular in UX from what I analyzed previously. The Katakana was a little bit more difficult to learn for some users. Pls lmk. Thanks!

こんにちは。
ログアウトしているとき、ヘッダーは固定されていないようですが、不具合でしょうか :question:

伝わっていないのかもしれないので、補足します。

Header is no sticky , without wikimedia . It’s bug ?

Previous input suggests that log-out users don’t have the sticky headers avail? Is this functionality limited to log-in users?